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k a March Highlights and 2025 AoPS Online Class Information
jlacosta   0
Mar 2, 2025
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Be sure to mark your calendars for the following events:
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0 replies
jlacosta
Mar 2, 2025
0 replies
k i Adding contests to the Contest Collections
dcouchman   1
N Apr 5, 2023 by v_Enhance
Want to help AoPS remain a valuable Olympiad resource? Help us add contests to AoPS's Contest Collections.

Find instructions and a list of contests to add here: https://artofproblemsolving.com/community/c40244h1064480_contests_to_add
1 reply
dcouchman
Sep 9, 2019
v_Enhance
Apr 5, 2023
k i Zero tolerance
ZetaX   49
N May 4, 2019 by NoDealsHere
Source: Use your common sense! (enough is enough)
Some users don't want to learn, some other simply ignore advises.
But please follow the following guideline:


To make it short: ALWAYS USE YOUR COMMON SENSE IF POSTING!
If you don't have common sense, don't post.


More specifically:

For new threads:


a) Good, meaningful title:
The title has to say what the problem is about in best way possible.
If that title occured already, it's definitely bad. And contest names aren't good either.
That's in fact a requirement for being able to search old problems.

Examples:
Bad titles:
- "Hard"/"Medium"/"Easy" (if you find it so cool how hard/easy it is, tell it in the post and use a title that tells us the problem)
- "Number Theory" (hey guy, guess why this forum's named that way¿ and is it the only such problem on earth¿)
- "Fibonacci" (there are millions of Fibonacci problems out there, all posted and named the same...)
- "Chinese TST 2003" (does this say anything about the problem¿)
Good titles:
- "On divisors of a³+2b³+4c³-6abc"
- "Number of solutions to x²+y²=6z²"
- "Fibonacci numbers are never squares"


b) Use search function:
Before posting a "new" problem spend at least two, better five, minutes to look if this problem was posted before. If it was, don't repost it. If you have anything important to say on topic, post it in one of the older threads.
If the thread is locked cause of this, use search function.

Update (by Amir Hossein). The best way to search for two keywords in AoPS is to input
[code]+"first keyword" +"second keyword"[/code]
so that any post containing both strings "first word" and "second form".


c) Good problem statement:
Some recent really bad post was:
[quote]$lim_{n\to 1}^{+\infty}\frac{1}{n}-lnn$[/quote]
It contains no question and no answer.
If you do this, too, you are on the best way to get your thread deleted. Write everything clearly, define where your variables come from (and define the "natural" numbers if used). Additionally read your post at least twice before submitting. After you sent it, read it again and use the Edit-Button if necessary to correct errors.


For answers to already existing threads:


d) Of any interest and with content:
Don't post things that are more trivial than completely obvious. For example, if the question is to solve $x^{3}+y^{3}=z^{3}$, do not answer with "$x=y=z=0$ is a solution" only. Either you post any kind of proof or at least something unexpected (like "$x=1337, y=481, z=42$ is the smallest solution). Someone that does not see that $x=y=z=0$ is a solution of the above without your post is completely wrong here, this is an IMO-level forum.
Similar, posting "I have solved this problem" but not posting anything else is not welcome; it even looks that you just want to show off what a genius you are.

e) Well written and checked answers:
Like c) for new threads, check your solutions at least twice for mistakes. And after sending, read it again and use the Edit-Button if necessary to correct errors.



To repeat it: ALWAYS USE YOUR COMMON SENSE IF POSTING!


Everything definitely out of range of common sense will be locked or deleted (exept for new users having less than about 42 posts, they are newbies and need/get some time to learn).

The above rules will be applied from next monday (5. march of 2007).
Feel free to discuss on this here.
49 replies
ZetaX
Feb 27, 2007
NoDealsHere
May 4, 2019
Numbers from 1 to 15 with rare properties
hectorleo123   1
N 26 minutes ago by EmersonSoriano
Source: 2015 Peru Cono Sur TST P2
Let $a, b, c$ and $d$ be elements of the set $\{ 1, 2, 3,\ldots , 2014, 2015 \}$ such that $a < b < c < d$, $a + b$ is a divisor of $c + d$, and $a + c$ is a divisor of $b + d$. Determine the largest value that $a$ can take.
1 reply
hectorleo123
Jul 10, 2023
EmersonSoriano
26 minutes ago
Number Theory
MuradSafarli   3
N an hour ago by MuradSafarli
find all natural numbers \( (a, b) \) such that the following equation holds:

\[
7^a + 1 = 2b^2
\]
3 replies
MuradSafarli
2 hours ago
MuradSafarli
an hour ago
Abelkonkurransen 2025 2a
Lil_flip38   1
N 2 hours ago by RANDOM__USER
Source: Abelkonkurransen
A teacher asks each of eleven pupils to write a positive integer with at most four digits, each on a separate yellow sticky note. Show that if all the numbers are different, the teacher can always submit two or more of the eleven stickers so that the average of the numbers on the selected notes are not an integer.
1 reply
Lil_flip38
Today at 11:10 AM
RANDOM__USER
2 hours ago
Abelkonkurransen 2025 2b
Lil_flip38   3
N 2 hours ago by alexanderhamilton124
Source: abelkonkurransen
Which positive integers $a$ have the property that \(n!-a\) is a perfect square for infinitely many positive integers \(n\)?
3 replies
Lil_flip38
Today at 11:12 AM
alexanderhamilton124
2 hours ago
Oi! These lines concur
Rg230403   18
N 3 hours ago by HoRI_DA_GRe8
Source: LMAO 2021 P5, LMAOSL G3(simplified)
Let $I, O$ and $\Gamma$ respectively be the incentre, circumcentre and circumcircle of triangle $ABC$. Points $A_1, A_2$ are chosen on $\Gamma$, such that $AA_1 = AI = AA_2$, and point $A'$ is the foot of the altitude from $I$ to $A_1A_2$. If $B', C'$ are similarly defined, prove that lines $AA', BB'$ and $CC'$ concurr on $OI$.
Original Version from SL
Proposed by Mahavir Gandhi
18 replies
Rg230403
May 10, 2021
HoRI_DA_GRe8
3 hours ago
Incircle
PDHT   0
4 hours ago
Source: Nguyen Minh Ha
Given a triangle \(ABC\) that is not isosceles at \(A\), let \((I)\) be its incircle, which is tangent to \(BC, CA, AB\) at \(D, E, F\), respectively. The lines \(DE\) and \(DF\) intersect the line passing through \(A\) and parallel to \(BC\) at \(M\) and \(N\), respectively. The lines passing through \(M, N\) and perpendicular to \(MN\) intersect \(IF\) and \(IE\) at \(Q\) and \(P\), respectively.

Prove that \(D, P, Q\) are collinear and that \(PF, QE, DI\) are concurrent.
0 replies
PDHT
4 hours ago
0 replies
Surprisingly low answer to the question what is the maximum
mshtand1   2
N 4 hours ago by sarjinius
Source: Ukrainian Mathematical Olympiad 2025. Day 2, Problem 8.6, 10.5
Given $2025$ positive integer numbers such that the least common multiple (LCM) of all these numbers is not a perfect square. Mykhailo consecutively hides one of these numbers and writes down the LCM of the remaining $2024$ numbers that are not hidden. What is the maximum number of the $2025$ written numbers that can be perfect squares?

Proposed by Oleksii Masalitin
2 replies
mshtand1
Mar 13, 2025
sarjinius
4 hours ago
Functional Equation
AnhQuang_67   5
N 4 hours ago by megarnie
Find all functions $f:\mathbb{R} \to \mathbb{R}$ satisfying: $$f(xf(y)+2y)=f(f(y))+f(xy)+xf(y), \forall x, y \in \mathbb{R}$$
5 replies
AnhQuang_67
6 hours ago
megarnie
4 hours ago
hard ............ (2)
Noname23   1
N 4 hours ago by Amkan2022
problem
1 reply
Noname23
5 hours ago
Amkan2022
4 hours ago
Fun issue about Euler’s function
luutrongphuc   2
N 5 hours ago by vi144
Let $p$ is a prime number and $n,\alpha$ are positive integers. Prove that there exist infinitely $a$ such that $\phi(a),\phi(a+1),…,\phi(a+n)$ are divisible by $p^{\alpha}$
2 replies
luutrongphuc
Today at 11:27 AM
vi144
5 hours ago
Inequality with Mobius function and sum of divisors
Zhero   6
N 5 hours ago by allaith.sh
Source: ELMO Shortlist 2010, N1
For a positive integer $n$, let $\mu(n) = 0$ if $n$ is not squarefree and $(-1)^k$ if $n$ is a product of $k$ primes, and let $\sigma(n)$ be the sum of the divisors of $n$. Prove that for all $n$ we have
\[\left|\sum_{d|n}\frac{\mu(d)\sigma(d)}{d}\right| \geq \frac{1}{n}, \]
and determine when equality holds.

Wenyu Cao.
6 replies
Zhero
Jul 5, 2012
allaith.sh
5 hours ago
Prime math
shlesto_mojumder   0
5 hours ago
Source: Own
Let ${{6n+1}}_{n>0}$ be a sequance of natural integers. Proof that, any number in the sequance can be written only as $p$ or $p'^k$
or $p_1p_2p_3.......p_i$ for any $i,k$ and not necessarily distinct primes $p_m$ for $0<m<i+1$. And $p$ and $p'$ are same in some case.
0 replies
shlesto_mojumder
5 hours ago
0 replies
Thanks u!
Ruji2018252   2
N 5 hours ago by InterLoop
Find all f: R->R and
\[2^{xy}f(xy-1)+2^{x+y+1}f(x)f(y)=4xy-2,\forall x,y\in\mathbb{R}\]
2 replies
Ruji2018252
Today at 2:53 PM
InterLoop
5 hours ago
Time to bring it on!
giangtruong13   1
N 5 hours ago by mathlove_13520
Source: New probs
Prove that the equation $$x^2+y^2-z^2+2=xyz$$has no integer solutions
1 reply
giangtruong13
Today at 2:35 PM
mathlove_13520
5 hours ago
Polynomials and powers
rmtf1111   26
N Mar 18, 2025 by ihategeo_1969
Source: RMM 2018 Day 1 Problem 2
Determine whether there exist non-constant polynomials $P(x)$ and $Q(x)$ with real coefficients satisfying
$$P(x)^{10}+P(x)^9 = Q(x)^{21}+Q(x)^{20}.$$
26 replies
rmtf1111
Feb 24, 2018
ihategeo_1969
Mar 18, 2025
Polynomials and powers
G H J
G H BBookmark kLocked kLocked NReply
Source: RMM 2018 Day 1 Problem 2
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rmtf1111
698 posts
#1 • 12 Y
Y by Davi-8191, Snakes, microsoft_office_word, rkm0959, Mathuzb, Euiseu, opptoinfinity, meet18, IAmTheHazard, Rounak_iitr, Adventure10, Mango247
Determine whether there exist non-constant polynomials $P(x)$ and $Q(x)$ with real coefficients satisfying
$$P(x)^{10}+P(x)^9 = Q(x)^{21}+Q(x)^{20}.$$
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Hamel
392 posts
#3 • 2 Y
Y by Adventure10, Mango247
That's too easy I think.
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Lamp909
98 posts
#4 • 2 Y
Y by Adventure10, Mango247
Use first derivative
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rkm0959
1721 posts
#5 • 10 Y
Y by PARISsaintGERMAIN, Supercali, BobaFett101, hellomath010118, Nathanisme, trololo23, guptaamitu1, Adventure10, Mango247, Manteca
Denote $S_{f}$ as the solution set of $f(x)=0$. From the statement we know that $S_P \cup S_{P+1} = S_Q \cup S_{Q+1}$.
Since $10 \cdot \text{deg} P = 21 \cdot \text{deg} Q$, we have $\text{deg} P = 21x$ and $\text{deg} Q = 10x$.
Since $|S_{f}| \le \text{deg} f$ for polynomials $f$, we get that $|S_P| + |S_{P+1}| = |S_Q| + |S_{Q+1}| \le 20x$.

Now, here's a key lemma that solves the problem.

Lemma. For nonconstant polynomial $P$, $|S_P| + |S_{P+1}| \ge \text{deg} P +1$.

Proof of Lemma. Denote $P(x) = \prod_{i=1}^n (x-r_i)^{c_i}$ and $P(x)+1 = \prod_{i=1}^m (x-r_i')^{c_i'}$.
Clearly $r_i$ and $r'_i$ are pairwise distinct. Now look at $P'(x)$. This must have $r_i$ as a root with multiplicity $c_i-1$, and $r_i'$ as a root with multiplicity $c_i'-1$. This implies that $$ \text{deg} P-1 = \text{deg} P' \ge \sum_{i=1}^n (c_i-1) + \sum_{i=1}^m (c_i'-1) = 2 \cdot \text{deg} P - |S_P| - |S_{P+1}| $$Rearranging gives the desired lemma.

Now we have $20x \ge |S_P| + |S_{P+1}| \ge \text{deg} P +1 =21x+1$, an obvious contradiction.
This post has been edited 7 times. Last edited by rkm0959, Feb 27, 2018, 1:54 PM
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v_Enhance
6862 posts
#6 • 23 Y
Y by rkm0959, Ankoganit, AngleChasingXD, xdiegolazarox, Snakes, Mathuzb, Sskkrr, shon804, mijail, v4913, pcleong, ILOVEMYFAMILY, HamstPan38825, Kingsbane2139, denistusk, sabkx, kamatadu, Rounak_iitr, IAmTheHazard, Adventure10, Mango247, bhan2025, MS_asdfgzxcvb
The answer is no; here is the official solution. Assume $(P,Q)$ work, so $\deg P = 21n$ and $\deg Q = 10n$ for some $n$. Then we have: \begin{align*} 	1 &= \gcd(P,10P+9) = \gcd(P+1, 10P+9) \\ 	\implies 1 &= \gcd\left( P^{10} + P^9, 10P+9 \right) = \gcd\left( Q^{21} + Q^{20}, 10P+9 \right) \\ 	\implies 1 &= \gcd(Q, 10P+9). \end{align*}
Now, we take a derivative: \[ P' \cdot P^8 \cdot \left( 10P + 9 \right) 	= Q' \cdot Q^{19} \cdot \left( 21Q + 20 \right) \neq 0. \]Thus $10P+9$ should divide $Q' \cdot (21Q+20)$ but \[ \deg(10P+9) = 21n > 20n-1 = \deg(Q' \cdot (21Q+20)). \]
This post has been edited 2 times. Last edited by v_Enhance, Feb 25, 2018, 8:33 AM
Reason: clarify this is not mine
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WizardMath
2487 posts
#7 • 1 Y
Y by Adventure10
For brevity, I will denote $P(x) = P, Q(x) =Q$.
Note that the set of roots of $P$ is disjoint with that of $P+1$. Similarly for $Q$. Note that $P' = (P+1)'$, so the number of roots of $P'$, counting multiplicity must not be less than the sum of multiplicities of the roots of $P, P+1$ decreased by 1, so the number of roots of $P$ and $P+1$ is at least $\text{deg} P + 1$. But the number of roots of $P^{9} (P+1)$ doesn't exceed $\frac{20}{21} \deg P $, which is a contradiction.
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by WizardMath, Feb 24, 2018, 1:33 PM
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kjy1102
37 posts
#8 • 2 Y
Y by Adventure10, Mango247
Using derivative in polynomial has once presented https://artofproblemsolving.com/community/c6h1352166p7389123
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by kjy1102, Feb 24, 2018, 2:07 PM
Reason: d
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va2010
1276 posts
#9 • 5 Y
Y by Ankoganit, rmtf1111, Kingsbane2139, Adventure10, Mango247
If $a = X^{10} + X^9$ and $c = X^{21} + X^{20}$, the equation rewrites as $a \cdot p = c \cdot q$. It is clear that the polynomial $a$ is indecomposable. Then according to Corollary 2.18 in http://dept.math.lsa.umich.edu/~zieve/papers/peter.pdf (which is proven using monodromy groups) there exists a linear polynomial $\ell$ such that $\ell \cdot a = T_{10}$ or $\ell \cdot a = X^{10}$, where $T_{10}$ is the $10$th Chebyshev polynomial. The first case is impossible since $T_{10}$ contains a nontrivial coefficient of $x^8$ but not of $x^9$, and the second case is impossible since $a(-1) = a(0)$ but $(-1)^{10} \neq 0^{10}$.
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by va2010, Feb 24, 2018, 2:23 PM
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huricane
670 posts
#10 • 2 Y
Y by GGPiku, Adventure10
I think I have an elementary solution for the following more general problem(although I'm not 100% sure)

Let $k>l>2$ be two coprime integers. Prove that there are no non-constant polynomials $P(x)$ and $Q(x)$ with real coefficients such that $$P^{k+1}+P^k=Q^{l+1}+Q^l.$$
Even if this general problem is not true it would be interesting to find for which pairs $(k,l)$ the problem is true.
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by huricane, Feb 24, 2018, 6:33 PM
Reason: Edit
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WizardMath
2487 posts
#11 • 1 Y
Y by Adventure10
huricane wrote:
Even if this general problem is not true it would be interesting to find for which pairs $(k,l)$ the problem is true.

The official solution, for instance, proves this for $k \ge 1, l \ge 2k+1$.
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v_Enhance
6862 posts
#12 • 12 Y
Y by rkm0959, lminsl, Ankoganit, MNJ2357, RudraRockstar, v4913, tigerzhang, HamstPan38825, sabkx, Adventure10, Mango247, Kingsbane2139
Hamel wrote:
That's too easy I think.

Eh, no. ;)
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huricane
670 posts
#13 • 2 Y
Y by Adventure10, Mango247
WizardMath wrote:
huricane wrote:
Even if this general problem is not true it would be interesting to find for which pairs $(k,l)$ the problem is true.

The official solution, for instance, proves this for $k \ge 1, l \ge 2k+1$.

Yeah but their method wouldn't work for the general problem, since they use degree bounds.
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Hamel
392 posts
#14 • 2 Y
Y by Adventure10, Mango247
v_Enhance wrote:
Hamel wrote:
That's too easy I think.

Eh, no. ;)

Yeah right. Were it to give with distinct roots it would be easier.
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R8450932
58 posts
#15 • 3 Y
Y by Kingsbane2139, Adventure10, Mango247
İs it famous method to use derivative in polynomials?
So anyone who have seen USA TST 2017 problem could easily do this.
Does anyone know any handout/book about usage of derivative in polynomials or some problems about that topic other than USA TST and this one?
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nikolapavlovic
1246 posts
#16 • 9 Y
Y by R8450932, huricane, rmtf1111, nmd27082001, Kayak, gvole, sabkx, Adventure10, Mango247
The idea isn't really that uncommon,i mean any time you want some further information about roots or just kill the constant it seems like the right thing to do.For much older reference check this (problem 9)
Apparently Putnam 1957 B7 wrote:
Problem let $S(P)$ be the set of the roots of $P$ not counting multiplicity.Is it possible that $S(P)\equiv S(Q)$ and $S(P+1)\equiv S(Q+1)$ ?

Or even a more well know result Mason's theorem ,where the proof essentially goes along the lines of writing $\tfrac{a}{c}+\tfrac{b}{c}=1$ and differentiating to kill the one on the LHS.
This post has been edited 2 times. Last edited by nikolapavlovic, Feb 25, 2018, 10:20 AM
Reason: added the link
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achen29
561 posts
#18 • 1 Y
Y by Adventure10
Lamp909 wrote:
Use first derivative

Isn't calculus "loathed" in olympiads.? I mean can you clarify when can one use or not use calculus to solve a problem?
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lminsl
544 posts
#21 • 7 Y
Y by huricane, GGPiku, rmtf1111, rkm0959, MNJ2357, Adventure10, Mango247
Edit: Wrong Sol :(

Solution
This post has been edited 11 times. Last edited by lminsl, Mar 10, 2019, 4:43 AM
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Géza Kós
111 posts
#22 • 3 Y
Y by WolfusA, opptoinfinity, Adventure10
The key statement $|S_P|+|S_{P+1}|\ge \deg P+1$ is same as IMC 2000 day 2, prob 3.
See http://imc-math.org.uk/imc2000/prob_sol2.pdf
The author was Marianna Csörnyei.
This post has been edited 2 times. Last edited by Géza Kós, Mar 1, 2018, 2:01 PM
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math_pi_rate
1218 posts
#23 • 1 Y
Y by Adventure10
Here's my solution: I invoke notation from post #5. Then we have $|S_P| + |S_{P+1}| = |S_Q| + |S_{Q+1}| \le 20x$, where $\text{deg} (P) = 21x$ and $\text{deg} (Q) = 10x$ as shown in rkm0959's solution. Now, we look at the Lemma given below (it is basically a generalization of the Lemma in post #5), after which we can finish in a similar fashion as in rkm0959's solution.

LEMMA: Let $F \in \mathbb{R}[x]$ be a non-constant real valued polynomial of degree $n$ $(n \geq 1)$. Consider the $m+1$ distinct real numbers $r_1,r_2, \dots ,r_{m+1}$ where $m \in \mathbb{N}$. Then the total number of complex solutions to the equation $F(x)=r_i$ for all $i \in \{1,2, \dots ,m+1\}$ is at least $mn+1$. (The previous Lemma follows on taking $m=1$ and $r_1=0,r_2=-1$)

Proof of Lemma We always use $i$ to denote the integers from $1$ to $m+1$. First consider a general polynomial $A \in \mathbb{R}[x]$. Suppose that $\gcd(A,A')$ has degree $s$, where $A'$ is the first derivative of $A$. Then there exist $s$ roots of $A$ (not necessarily distinct) which are roots of $A'$ also, which means that the remaining roots of $A$ are distinct and correspond to the elements of $S_A$ (Just use the fact that roots of $A$ with multiplicity $a$ have multiplicity $a-1$ in $A'$). So we have $|S_A|=\text{deg}(A)-s$. Return to our Lemma. Letting $X$ denote the total number of solutions to the given equations, and using the fact that $(F-r_i)'=F'$, we have $$X=\sum_{i=1}^{m+1} n-\text{deg} (\gcd(F-r_i,F'))=(m+1)n-\sum_{i=1}^{m+1} \text{deg}(\gcd(F-r_i,F'))$$Then we wish to show that $X \geq mn+1$, which is equivalent to showing that $$(m+1)n-\sum_{i=1}^{m+1} \text{deg}(\gcd(F-r_i,F')) \geq mn+1 \Leftrightarrow \sum_{i=1}^{m+1} \text{deg}(\gcd(F-r_i,F')) \leq n-1 \text{ } \forall m \in \mathbb{N}$$Consider the polynomial $G(x)=(F(x)-r_1)(F(x)-r_2) \dots (F(x)-r_{m+1})$. As all these terms in product are pairwise co-prime, so we get that $$\sum_{i=1}^{m+1} \text{deg}(\gcd(F-r_i,F'))=\text{deg}(\gcd(G,F')) \leq \text{deg}(F') \leq \deg(F)-1=n-1 \quad \blacksquare$$
REMARK: The Lemma is tbh just a mixture of some well-known facts. For example, the fact that the number of distinct roots of a polynomial $A$ is $\text{deg}(A)-\text{deg}(\gcd(A,A'))$ is well-known (maybe not exactly in that form). Similarly, the second half of the proof of the Lemma (introducing $G$) is well motivated if one catches hold of the fact that degrees get added on multiplying pairwise co-prime polynomials.
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by math_pi_rate, Feb 25, 2019, 12:12 PM
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Spacesam
597 posts
#24
Y by
Haha derivative go brrr. We get \begin{align*}
    P(x)^9 \left(P(x) + 1 \right) &= Q(x)^{20} \left(Q(x) + 1 \right) \\
    P'(x) \cdot P(x)^8 \left(10P(x) + 9 \right) &= Q'(x) \cdot Q(x)^{19} \left(21Q(x) + 20 \right)
\end{align*}to work with.

By analyzing the leading term of both sides in the first equation, and because $\gcd(10, 21) = 1$, we find that the degree of $P$ is $21c$ for some $c$ and the degree of $Q$ is $10c$.

Observe that $Q(x)$ divides $P(x)(P(x) + 1)$. Additionally, notice that \begin{align*}
    \gcd(10P(x) + 9, P(x) + 1) = \gcd(10P(x) + 9, P(x)) = 1,
\end{align*}hence we know that $10P(x) + 9$ divides $Q'(x) \cdot (21Q(x) + 20)$. But this is cap; the degree of the left is $21c$ and the degree of the right is $10c - 1 + 10c = 20c - 1$, smaller. Thus we are done.
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ILOVEMYFAMILY
641 posts
#25
Y by
v_Enhance wrote:
The answer is no; here is the official solution. Assume $(P,Q)$ work, so $\deg P = 21n$ and $\deg Q = 10n$ for some $n$. Then we have: \begin{align*} 	1 &= \gcd(P,10P+9) = \gcd(P+1, 10P+9) \\ 	\implies 1 &= \gcd\left( P^{10} + P^9, 10P+9 \right) = \gcd\left( Q^{21} + Q^{20}, 10P+9 \right) \\ 	\implies 1 &= \gcd(Q, 10P+9). \end{align*}
Now, we take a derivative: \[ P' \cdot P^8 \cdot \left( 10P + 9 \right) 	= Q' \cdot Q^{19} \cdot \left( 21Q + 20 \right) \neq 0. \]Thus $10P+9$ should divide $Q' \cdot (21Q+20)$ but \[ \deg(10P+9) = 21n > 20n-1 = \deg(Q' \cdot (21Q+20)). \]

What does gcd (P,Q) mean? I never see the definition of greatest common divisor for polynomial.Can you explain,plz?
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IAmTheHazard
5000 posts
#26
Y by
A bit overcomplicated but the idea is the same.

The answer is no.
Suppose $r$ is an arbitrary root of either side of the equation (we will refer to this as a "root of the equation"), and let $(A,B)$ denote $\gcd(A,B)$. We consider four cases—note that $r$ must fall in exactly one of these.
If $r$ is a root of $(P,Q)$, then it is a root of $P(x)^{10}+P(x)^9$ with multiplicity divisible by $9$, and a root of $Q(x)^{21}+Q(x)^{20}$ with multiplicity divisible by $20$. Thus $r$ is a root of the equation, it must have multiplicity divisible by $180$. Thus we can say that there are $A$ distinct roots of the equation which contribute a total multiplicity of $180a$.
If $r$ is a root of $(P+1,Q)$, then it is a root of the equation with multiplicity divisible by $20$, so we can say there are $B$ distinct roots with total multiplicity $20b$.
If $r$ is a root of $(P,Q+1)$, then we can say there are $C$ distinct roots with total multiplicity $9c$.
If $r$ is a root of $(P+1,Q+1)$, then we can say there are $D$ distinct roots with total multiplicity $d$.
Note that $A \leq a$ and similarly for the other pairs of variables.
Now, note that $P$ will have exactly $20a+c$ roots with multiplicity (since each root contributes nine times) and $P+1$ will have exactly $20b+d$ roots with multiplicity (since each root contributes once). Likewise, $Q$ will have exactly $9a+b$ roots and $Q+1$ will have exactly $9c+d$ roots.
It is well-known (say, by the product rule) that for any root of a polynomial $f$ with multiplicity $m$ is a root of $f'$ with multiplicity $m-1$. Thus, $P'$ has at least $20a+20b+c+d-A-B-C-D$ roots (with multiplicity). Thus,
$$20a+20b+c+d-A-B-C-D \leq \deg P'=\deg P-1=20a+c-1 \implies 20b+d\leq A+B+C+D-1,$$and similarly $20a+c\leq A+B+C+D-1$ (from looking at $P+1$ instead of $P$), so
$$20a+20b+c+d\leq 2A+2B+2C+2D-2 \leq 2a+2b+2c+2d-2 \implies 18a+18b+2 \leq c+d.$$On the other hand, this means that
$$\deg Q=9a+b<18a+18b+2\leq c+d\leq 9c+d=\deg (Q+1),$$which is absurd, hence no such polynomials exist. $\blacksquare$
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HamstPan38825
8854 posts
#27
Y by
The answer is no. The key is the following lemma.

Lemma. Let $\mathcal S(P)$ denote the set of roots, without multiplicity, of a polynomial $P$. Then $$|\mathcal S(P)| + |\mathcal S(P+1)| \geq \deg P + 1.$$
Proof. See here. (Indeed, the similarity to that problem has been pointed out previously in the thread.) $\blacksquare$

First, by comparing degrees, $\deg P = 21k$ and $\deg Q = 10k$ for some positive integer $k$.

Now notice that $$|\mathcal S(P(x)^{10} + P(x)^9)| = |\mathcal S(P(x))| + |\mathcal S(P(x) + 1)| \geq 21k+1$$by the lemma. On the other hand, $$|\mathcal S(Q(x)^{21} + Q(x)^{20})| \leq \deg Q + \deg(Q+1) = 20k.$$This yields a contradiction. $\blacksquare$
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by HamstPan38825, Jul 7, 2023, 8:13 AM
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asdf334
7586 posts
#28 • 2 Y
Y by megarnie, bjump
i hate algebra i hate algebra i hate algebra i hate algebra

why does it have to be calculus?? also missed the other P, P+1 question in DAW realpoly whoops
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CT17
1481 posts
#29 • 4 Y
Y by InterLoop, ex-center, CyclicISLscelesTrapezoid, bjump
We will consider both the given equation $P^9(P+1) = Q^{20}(Q+1)$ and its derivative $P^8P'(10P+9) = Q^{19}Q'(21Q+20)$. The former implies that any root $r$ of $Q$ is a root of $P$ or $P+1$. In particular, $Q$ does not share any roots with $10P+9$, so $10P+9\mid Q'(21Q+20)$. However this is absurd since $\text{deg}P = \frac{21}{10}\text{deg}Q$, so no such polynomials exist.

Edit: milestone post or something.
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by CT17, Feb 27, 2024, 3:45 PM
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N3bula
254 posts
#30
Y by
We have that $\deg(Q(x))=10n$ and $\deg (P(x))=21n$ for some $n$. Clearly we have that all the roots of $P(x)$ and all the roots of $P(x)+1$
are also roots of either $Q(x)$ or $Q(x)+1$. Let $P$ be the set of distinct roots of $P(x)$, $P_1$ be the set of distinct roots of $P(x)+1$ and
define $Q$ and $Q_1$ similarly. We have that $\vert P \cup P_1 \vert \geq 21n+1$ by Putnam 1956 B7, thus we also get that as $\deg(Q(x))=10n$,
$\vert Q \cup Q_1 \vert \leq 20n$, so we have a contradiction and thus no such polynomials exist.
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ihategeo_1969
162 posts
#31
Y by
I replaced $P$ and $Q$ in question by mistake and Im too lazy to change, sorry.

The answer is $\boxed{\text{no}}$.

Assume there does then see that $\deg P=10d$ and $\deg Q=21d$ for some $d>0$. Differentiate it once and see that we have the equations \begin{align*}
& P^{20}(P+1)=Q^9(Q+1) \\
& P^{19} \cdot P' (21P+20)=Q^8 \cdot Q'(10Q+9)
\end{align*}Divide the two equations and we get \[(Q+1)QP'(21P+20)=(P+1)PQ'(10Q+9]\]But see that $\gcd(Q(Q+1),10Q+9)=1$ anfd so we have \[(Q+1)Q \mid (P+1)PQ' \implies 42d \le 20d+21d=41d\]Which is a contradiction.
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by ihategeo_1969, Mar 18, 2025, 7:26 AM
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