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k a April Highlights and 2025 AoPS Online Class Information
jlacosta   0
Apr 2, 2025
Spring is in full swing and summer is right around the corner, what are your plans? At AoPS Online our schedule has new classes starting now through July, so be sure to keep your skills sharp and be prepared for the Fall school year! Check out the schedule of upcoming classes below.

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April 9th (Webinar), 4:00pm PT/7:00pm ET, Learn about Video-based Summer Camps at the Virtual Campus
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[*]April 22nd (Webinar), 4:00pm PT/7:00pm ET, Competitive Programming at AoPS (USACO).[/list]
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0 replies
jlacosta
Apr 2, 2025
0 replies
k i A Letter to MSM
Arr0w   23
N Sep 19, 2022 by scannose
Greetings.

I have seen many posts talking about commonly asked questions, such as finding the value of $0^0$, $\frac{1}{0}$,$\frac{0}{0}$, $\frac{\infty}{\infty}$, why $0.999...=1$ or even expressions of those terms combined as if that would make them defined. I have made this post to answer these questions once and for all, and I politely ask everyone to link this post to threads that are talking about this issue.
[list]
[*]Firstly, the case of $0^0$. It is usually regarded that $0^0=1$, not because this works numerically but because it is convenient to define it this way. You will see the convenience of defining other undefined things later on in this post.

[*]What about $\frac{\infty}{\infty}$? The issue here is that $\infty$ isn't even rigorously defined in this expression. What exactly do we mean by $\infty$? Unless the example in question is put in context in a formal manner, then we say that $\frac{\infty}{\infty}$ is meaningless.

[*]What about $\frac{1}{0}$? Suppose that $x=\frac{1}{0}$. Then we would have $x\cdot 0=0=1$, absurd. A more rigorous treatment of the idea is that $\lim_{x\to0}\frac{1}{x}$ does not exist in the first place, although you will see why in a calculus course. So the point is that $\frac{1}{0}$ is undefined.

[*]What about if $0.99999...=1$? An article from brilliant has a good explanation. Alternatively, you can just use a geometric series. Notice that
\begin{align*}
\sum_{n=1}^{\infty} \frac{9}{10^n}&=9\sum_{n=1}^{\infty}\frac{1}{10^n}=9\sum_{n=1}^{\infty}\biggr(\frac{1}{10}\biggr)^n=9\biggr(\frac{\frac{1}{10}}{1-\frac{1}{10}}\biggr)=9\biggr(\frac{\frac{1}{10}}{\frac{9}{10}}\biggr)=9\biggr(\frac{1}{9}\biggr)=\boxed{1}
\end{align*}
[*]What about $\frac{0}{0}$? Usually this is considered to be an indeterminate form, but I would also wager that this is also undefined.
[/list]
Hopefully all of these issues and their corollaries are finally put to rest. Cheers.

2nd EDIT (6/14/22): Since I originally posted this, it has since blown up so I will try to add additional information per the request of users in the thread below.

INDETERMINATE VS UNDEFINED

What makes something indeterminate? As you can see above, there are many things that are indeterminate. While definitions might vary slightly, it is the consensus that the following definition holds: A mathematical expression is be said to be indeterminate if it is not definitively or precisely determined. So how does this make, say, something like $0/0$ indeterminate? In analysis (the theory behind calculus and beyond), limits involving an algebraic combination of functions in an independent variable may often be evaluated by replacing these functions by their limits. However, if the expression obtained after this substitution does not provide sufficient information to determine the original limit, then the expression is called an indeterminate form. For example, we could say that $0/0$ is an indeterminate form.

But we need to more specific, this is still ambiguous. An indeterminate form is a mathematical expression involving at most two of $0$, $1$ or $\infty$, obtained by applying the algebraic limit theorem (a theorem in analysis, look this up for details) in the process of attempting to determine a limit, which fails to restrict that limit to one specific value or infinity, and thus does not determine the limit being calculated. This is why it is called indeterminate. Some examples of indeterminate forms are
\[0/0, \infty/\infty, \infty-\infty, \infty \times 0\]etc etc. So what makes something undefined? In the broader scope, something being undefined refers to an expression which is not assigned an interpretation or a value. A function is said to be undefined for points outside its domain. For example, the function $f:\mathbb{R}^{+}\cup\{0\}\rightarrow\mathbb{R}$ given by the mapping $x\mapsto \sqrt{x}$ is undefined for $x<0$. On the other hand, $1/0$ is undefined because dividing by $0$ is not defined in arithmetic by definition. In other words, something is undefined when it is not defined in some mathematical context.

WHEN THE WATERS GET MUDDIED

So with this notion of indeterminate and undefined, things get convoluted. First of all, just because something is indeterminate does not mean it is not undefined. For example $0/0$ is considered both indeterminate and undefined (but in the context of a limit then it is considered in indeterminate form). Additionally, this notion of something being undefined also means that we can define it in some way. To rephrase, this means that technically, we can make something that is undefined to something that is defined as long as we define it. I'll show you what I mean.

One example of making something undefined into something defined is the extended real number line, which we define as
\[\overline{\mathbb{R}}=\mathbb{R}\cup \{-\infty,+\infty\}.\]So instead of treating infinity as an idea, we define infinity (positively and negatively, mind you) as actual numbers in the reals. The advantage of doing this is for two reasons. The first is because we can turn this thing into a totally ordered set. Specifically, we can let $-\infty\le a\le \infty$ for each $a\in\overline{\mathbb{R}}$ which means that via this order topology each subset has an infimum and supremum and $\overline{\mathbb{R}}$ is therefore compact. While this is nice from an analytic standpoint, extending the reals in this way can allow for interesting arithmetic! In $\overline{\mathbb{R}}$ it is perfectly OK to say that,
\begin{align*}
a + \infty = \infty + a & = \infty, & a & \neq -\infty \\
a - \infty = -\infty + a & = -\infty, & a & \neq \infty \\
a \cdot (\pm\infty) = \pm\infty \cdot a & = \pm\infty, & a & \in (0, +\infty] \\
a \cdot (\pm\infty) = \pm\infty \cdot a & = \mp\infty, & a & \in [-\infty, 0) \\
\frac{a}{\pm\infty} & = 0, & a & \in \mathbb{R} \\
\frac{\pm\infty}{a} & = \pm\infty, & a & \in (0, +\infty) \\
\frac{\pm\infty}{a} & = \mp\infty, & a & \in (-\infty, 0).
\end{align*}So addition, multiplication, and division are all defined nicely. However, notice that we have some indeterminate forms here which are also undefined,
\[\infty-\infty,\frac{\pm\infty}{\pm\infty},\frac{\pm\infty}{0},0\cdot \pm\infty.\]So while we define certain things, we also left others undefined/indeterminate in the process! However, in the context of measure theory it is common to define $\infty \times 0=0$ as greenturtle3141 noted below. I encourage to reread what he wrote, it's great stuff! As you may notice, though, dividing by $0$ is undefined still! Is there a place where it isn't? Kind of. To do this, we can extend the complex numbers! More formally, we can define this extension as
\[\mathbb{C}^*=\mathbb{C}\cup\{\tilde{\infty}\}\]which we call the Riemann Sphere (it actually forms a sphere, pretty cool right?). As a note, $\tilde{\infty}$ means complex infinity, since we are in the complex plane now. Here's the catch: division by $0$ is allowed here! In fact, we have
\[\frac{z}{0}=\tilde{\infty},\frac{z}{\tilde{\infty}}=0.\]where $\tilde{\infty}/\tilde{\infty}$ and $0/0$ are left undefined. We also have
\begin{align*}
z+\tilde{\infty}=\tilde{\infty}, \forall z\ne -\infty\\
z\times \tilde{\infty}=\tilde{\infty}, \forall z\ne 0
\end{align*}Furthermore, we actually have some nice properties with multiplication that we didn't have before. In $\mathbb{C}^*$ it holds that
\[\tilde{\infty}\times \tilde{\infty}=\tilde{\infty}\]but $\tilde{\infty}-\tilde{\infty}$ and $0\times \tilde{\infty}$ are left as undefined (unless there is an explicit need to change that somehow). One could define the projectively extended reals as we did with $\mathbb{C}^*$, by defining them as
\[{\widehat {\mathbb {R} }}=\mathbb {R} \cup \{\infty \}.\]They behave in a similar way to the Riemann Sphere, with division by $0$ also being allowed with the same indeterminate forms (in addition to some other ones).
23 replies
Arr0w
Feb 11, 2022
scannose
Sep 19, 2022
k i Marathon Threads
LauraZed   0
Jul 2, 2019
Due to excessive spam and inappropriate posts, we have locked the Prealgebra and Beginning Algebra threads.

We will either unlock these threads once we've cleaned them up or start new ones, but for now, do not start new marathon threads for these subjects. Any new marathon threads started while this announcement is up will be immediately deleted.
0 replies
LauraZed
Jul 2, 2019
0 replies
k i Basic Forum Rules and Info (Read before posting)
jellymoop   368
N May 16, 2018 by harry1234
f (Reminder: Do not post Alcumus or class homework questions on this forum. Instructions below.) f
Welcome to the Middle School Math Forum! Please take a moment to familiarize yourself with the rules.

Overview:
[list]
[*] When you're posting a new topic with a math problem, give the topic a detailed title that includes the subject of the problem (not just "easy problem" or "nice problem")
[*] Stay on topic and be courteous.
[*] Hide solutions!
[*] If you see an inappropriate post in this forum, simply report the post and a moderator will deal with it. Don't make your own post telling people they're not following the rules - that usually just makes the issue worse.
[*] When you post a question that you need help solving, post what you've attempted so far and not just the question. We are here to learn from each other, not to do your homework. :P
[*] Avoid making posts just to thank someone - you can use the upvote function instead
[*] Don't make a new reply just to repeat yourself or comment on the quality of others' posts; instead, post when you have a new insight or question. You can also edit your post if it's the most recent and you want to add more information.
[*] Avoid bumping old posts.
[*] Use GameBot to post alcumus questions.
[*] If you need general MATHCOUNTS/math competition advice, check out the threads below.
[*] Don't post other users' real names.
[*] Advertisements are not allowed. You can advertise your forum on your profile with a link, on your blog, and on user-created forums that permit forum advertisements.
[/list]

Here are links to more detailed versions of the rules. These are from the older forums, so you can overlook "Classroom math/Competition math only" instructions.
Posting Guidelines
Update on Basic Forum Rules
What belongs on this forum?
How do I write a thorough solution?
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How do I study for mathcounts?
Mathcounts FAQ and resources
Mathcounts and how to learn

As always, if you have any questions, you can PM me or any of the other Middle School Moderators. Once again, if you see spam, it would help a lot if you filed a report instead of responding :)

Marathons!
Relays might be a better way to describe it, but these threads definitely go the distance! One person starts off by posting a problem, and the next person comes up with a solution and a new problem for another user to solve. Here's some of the frequently active marathons running in this forum:
[list][*]Algebra
[*]Prealgebra
[*]Proofs
[*]Factoring
[*]Geometry
[*]Counting & Probability
[*]Number Theory[/list]
Some of these haven't received attention in a while, but these are the main ones for their respective subjects. Rather than starting a new marathon, please give the existing ones a shot first.

You can also view marathons via the Marathon tag.

Think this list is incomplete or needs changes? Let the mods know and we'll take a look.
368 replies
jellymoop
May 8, 2015
harry1234
May 16, 2018
Cevian cutting triangles, side to perimeter proportional
awesomeming327.   0
12 minutes ago
Source: own
For any three points $X$, $Y$, $Z$ define $s(XYZ)$ to be the semiperimeter of $\triangle XYZ$. Let $\triangle ABC$ be a triangle and let $D$ be on side $BC$ such that
\[\frac{s(ABD)}{BD}=\frac{s(ACD)}{CD}\]Let $P$ be a point on $AD$. Let $Q$ and $R$ be on $AB$ and $AC$ such that $AP+AQ=s(ABD)$ and $AP+AR=s(ACD)$. Prove that there exists a line $\ell$ parallel to $BC$ such that the circumcircles of $APQ$ and $APR$ intersect $\ell$ at two fixed points.
0 replies
2 viewing
awesomeming327.
12 minutes ago
0 replies
Only consecutive terms are coprime
socrates   36
N an hour ago by deduck
Source: 7th RMM 2015, Problem 1
Does there exist an infinite sequence of positive integers $a_1, a_2, a_3, . . .$ such that $a_m$ and $a_n$ are coprime if and only if $|m - n| = 1$?
36 replies
socrates
Feb 28, 2015
deduck
an hour ago
Colouring digits to make a rational Number
Rg230403   3
N 2 hours ago by quantam13
Source: India EGMO 2022 TST P4
Let $N$ be a positive integer. Suppose given any real $x\in (0,1)$ with decimal representation $0.a_1a_2a_3a_4\cdots$, one can color the digits $a_1,a_2,\cdots$ with $N$ colors so that the following hold:
1. each color is used at least once;
2. for any color, if we delete all the digits in $x$ except those of this color, the resulting decimal number is rational.
Find the least possible value of $N$.

~Sutanay Bhattacharya
3 replies
Rg230403
Nov 28, 2021
quantam13
2 hours ago
flipping rows on a matrix in F2
danepale   17
N 2 hours ago by eg4334
Source: Croatia TST 2016
Let $N$ be a positive integer. Consider a $N \times N$ array of square unit cells. Two corner cells that lie on the same longest diagonal are colored black, and the rest of the array is white. A move consists of choosing a row or a column and changing the color of every cell in the chosen row or column.
What is the minimal number of additional cells that one has to color black such that, after a finite number of moves, a completely black board can be reached?
17 replies
danepale
Apr 27, 2016
eg4334
2 hours ago
The daily problem!
Leeoz   128
N 3 hours ago by sadas123
Every day, I will try to post a new problem for you all to solve! If you want to post a daily problem, you can! :)

Please hide solutions and answers, hints are fine though! :)

Problems usually get harder throughout the week, so Sunday is the easiest and Saturday is the hardest!

Past Problems!
128 replies
Leeoz
Mar 21, 2025
sadas123
3 hours ago
Something Interesting
ilikemath247365   11
N 4 hours ago by ilikemath247365
I just realized: The 2013 National MathCounts Sprint #24 is the EXACT SAME as the 2001 National MathCounts Sprint #28.
11 replies
ilikemath247365
Yesterday at 5:03 AM
ilikemath247365
4 hours ago
simplify inequality
ngelyy   13
N 4 hours ago by EthanNg6
$\frac{24x}{21}+\frac{35x}{49}-\frac{x}{2}$
13 replies
ngelyy
Apr 18, 2025
EthanNg6
4 hours ago
1234th Post!
PikaPika999   220
N 4 hours ago by miles888
I hit my 1234th post! (I think I missed it, I'm kinda late, :oops_sign:)

But here's a puzzle for you all! Try to create the numbers 1 through 25 using the numbers 1, 2, 3, and 4! You are only allowed to use addition, subtraction, multiplication, division, and parenthesis. If you're post #1, try to make 1. If you're post #2, try to make 2. If you're post #3, try to make 3, and so on. If you're a post after 25, then I guess you can try to make numbers greater than 25 but you can use factorials, square roots, and that stuff. Have fun!

1: $(4-3)\cdot(2-1)$
220 replies
PikaPika999
Apr 21, 2025
miles888
4 hours ago
random problem i just thought about one day
ceilingfan404   20
N 5 hours ago by RollingPanda4616
i don't even know if this is solvable
Prove that there are finite/infinite powers of 2 where all the digits are also powers of 2. (For example, $4$ and $128$ are numbers that work, but $64$ and $1024$ don't work.)
20 replies
ceilingfan404
Apr 20, 2025
RollingPanda4616
5 hours ago
2025 MATHCOUNTS State Target #8
ERMSCoach   1
N 6 hours ago by pieMax2713
The solution is wrong.

2/27 probability is for three flips, so the 'correct' answer from this solution should have been 27/2 * 3= 81/2 flips.

The correct answer for THT is 31/2.

The correct solution:

Let $E_H$ be the expected number of flips to get HTT after getting an H.
Then $E_H$ = (case TT) 1/3 * 1/3 * 2 + (case TH) 1/3 * 2/3 * ($E_H$+2) + (case H) 2/3 * ($E_H$+1)
$E_H$= 12
E = (case H) 2/3* (1+$E_H$) + (case T) 1/3*(1+E)
E=27/2

The only argument that can be made for this solution is the answer of 1/P is correct for sequences of H followed by Ts.
1 reply
ERMSCoach
Apr 20, 2025
pieMax2713
6 hours ago
9 When Is your Mathcounts State Competition?
MathyMathMan   151
N Yesterday at 9:20 PM by Gavin_Deng
When is your Mathcounts State Comp? Mine is on the 11th of March.
151 replies
MathyMathMan
Mar 1, 2023
Gavin_Deng
Yesterday at 9:20 PM
Nats 2024 cutoff Map
MathyMathMan   24
N Yesterday at 9:13 PM by MathRook7817
2024 MATHCOUNTS Nats Cutoff Map

Greetings!

I should first and foremost thank those who helped with this project along the way. This idea is fully inspired by past South Dakota alumni that attended my school. The original ideas were created by @anser and @techguy2. I would also like to thank @peace09 for agreeing to collaborate with me on the scores and ratings during the 2024 state competitions throughout the country.

@peace09's post Cutoffs and Scores

Please state your state and cutoff score. (4th place) You can also provide the 3rd, 2nd, and 1st place scores as well. People from different territories can also provide their state's scores as well. I will try my best to keep this map updated until we get all the scores. You are also free to discuss states and nationals stuff too if you want. :)

(Btw congratulations to everyone who made nationals, I hope to see you guys there too!)

Nats qualification scores
24 replies
MathyMathMan
Apr 4, 2024
MathRook7817
Yesterday at 9:13 PM
A twist on a classic
happypi31415   12
N Yesterday at 8:54 PM by pieMax2713
Rank from smallest to largest: $\sqrt[2]{2}$, $\sqrt[3]{3}$, and $\sqrt[5]{5}$.

Click to reveal hidden text
12 replies
happypi31415
Mar 17, 2025
pieMax2713
Yesterday at 8:54 PM
Books for AMC 10
GallopingUnicorn45   5
N Yesterday at 6:35 PM by MathPerson12321
Hi all,

So I'm in 4th grade, and I'm having a go at AMC 10 and I've got some questions.
First, how many questions are needed to get Achievement Roll and AIME?
Second, what should I grind to prepare? I took the Intro to Algebra, Counting & Probability, and Number Theory courses already, completed those three books and will be starting the Intro to Geometry book soon. I'm planning to grind the Competition Math for Middle School and try to add in Volume 1: The Basics along with the three books that I already finished, plus geometry. Is there anything else to prepare with besides Alcumus and past papers and those books?

Thanks!
5 replies
GallopingUnicorn45
Yesterday at 2:26 AM
MathPerson12321
Yesterday at 6:35 PM
Inequality while on a trip
giangtruong13   14
N Apr 17, 2025 by GeoMorocco
Source: Trip
I find this inequality while i was on a trip, it was pretty fun and i have some new experience:
Let $a,b,c \geq -2$ such that: $a^2+b^2+c^2 \leq 8$. Find the maximum: $$A= \sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3}$$
14 replies
giangtruong13
Apr 12, 2025
GeoMorocco
Apr 17, 2025
Inequality while on a trip
G H J
G H BBookmark kLocked kLocked NReply
Source: Trip
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giangtruong13
130 posts
#1 • 1 Y
Y by cubres
I find this inequality while i was on a trip, it was pretty fun and i have some new experience:
Let $a,b,c \geq -2$ such that: $a^2+b^2+c^2 \leq 8$. Find the maximum: $$A= \sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3}$$
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by giangtruong13, Apr 12, 2025, 12:25 PM
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sqing
41825 posts
#2 • 2 Y
Y by cubres, arqady
Let $a,b,c \geq -2$ such that $a^2+b^2+c^2 \leq 8.$ Prove that$$  \frac{1}{16+a^3}+\frac{1}{16+b^3}+\frac{1}{16+c^3}\leq \frac{5}{16}$$pretty fun
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by sqing, Apr 12, 2025, 1:48 PM
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giangtruong13
130 posts
#3 • 1 Y
Y by cubres
Bummer tummer
Z K Y
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no_room_for_error
332 posts
#4
Y by
giangtruong13 wrote:
I find this inequality while i was on a trip, it was pretty fun and i have some new experience:
Let $a,b,c \geq -2$ such that: $a^2+b^2+c^2 \leq 8$. Find the maximum: $$A= \sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3}$$

$$\frac{1}{16+a^3}=-\frac{a^2(a+2)(a^2-2a+8)}{64(a^3+16)}+\frac{1}{64}a^2+\frac{1}{16}\leq \frac{1}{64}a^2+\frac{1}{16}$$
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GeoMorocco
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#5
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giangtruong13 wrote:
I find this inequality while i was on a trip, it was pretty fun and i have some new experience:
Let $a,b,c \geq -2$ such that: $a^2+b^2+c^2 \leq 8$. Find the maximum: $$A= \sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3}$$
Obviously:
$$\sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3} \leq  \sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16-|a|^3}$$so we only need to study the inequality for negative numbers and the function is convex for $-2 \leq x \leq 0$.

The function is convex with a convex constraint, therefore it is enough to check the boundaries and we get a maximum at $(0,-2,-2)$ and the maximum value is equal to $\frac{5}{16}$.
This post has been edited 2 times. Last edited by GeoMorocco, Apr 16, 2025, 7:53 AM
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arqady
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#6
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GeoMorocco wrote:
giangtruong13 wrote:
I find this inequality while i was on a trip, it was pretty fun and i have some new experience:
Let $a,b,c \geq -2$ such that: $a^2+b^2+c^2 \leq 8$. Find the maximum: $$A= \sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3}$$

The function is convex...
$$\left( \frac{1}{16+a^3}\right)''=\frac{12a(a^3-8)}{(a^3+16)^3}$$;)
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GeoMorocco
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#7
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arqady wrote:
$$\left( \frac{1}{16+a^3}\right)''=\frac{12a(a^3-8)}{(a^3+16)^3}$$;)

Obviously:
$$\sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3} \leq  \sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16-|a|^3}$$so we only need to study the inequality for negative numbers and the function is convex for $-2 \leq x \leq 0$.
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by GeoMorocco, Apr 16, 2025, 7:52 AM
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arqady
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GeoMorocco wrote:
arqady wrote:
$$\left( \frac{1}{16+a^3}\right)''=\frac{12a(a^3-8)}{(a^3+16)^3}$$;)

Obviously:
$$\sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3} \leq  \sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16-|a|^3}$$so we only need to study the inequality for negative numbers and the function is convex for $-2 \leq x \leq 0$.
Can you write a new conditions and an inequality, that we need to prove now?
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GeoMorocco
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arqady wrote:
Can you write a new conditions and an inequality, that we need to prove now?
if at least one of the variables $a,b,c>0$, we get:
$$\sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3} < \frac{1}{16+0^3}+ \frac{1}{16+(-2)^3}+\frac{1}{16+(-2)^3}=\frac{1}{16}+\frac{1}{8}+\frac{1}{8}=\frac{5}{16}$$Therefore, it is enough to study the function for $a,b,c\leq 0$. But the function $f(x)=\frac{1}{16+x^3}$ is convex for $-2\leq x\leq 0$ with convex constraints, so it is enough to check the borders where we get a maximum at $(0,-2,-2)$ equal to $\frac{5}{16}$.
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by GeoMorocco, Apr 16, 2025, 1:19 PM
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arqady
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GeoMorocco wrote:
arqady wrote:
Can you write a new conditions and an inequality, that we need to prove now?
if at least one of the variables $a,b,c>0$, we get:
$$\sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3} < \frac{1}{16+0^3}+ \frac{1}{16+(-2)^3}+\frac{1}{16+(-2)^3}=\frac{1}{16}+\frac{1}{8}+\frac{1}{8}=\frac{5}{16}$$Therefore, it is enough to study the function for $a,b,c\leq 0$. But the function $f(x)=\frac{1}{16+x^3}$ is convex for $-2\leq x\leq 0$ with convex constraints, so it is enough to check the borders where we get a maximum at $(0,-2,-2)$ equal to $\frac{5}{16}$.

For $(-2,-2,-2)$ we obtain a greater value. Why don't we get a greater value with a condition $a^2+b^2+c^2\leq8$?
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GeoMorocco
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#11
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arqady wrote:
For $(-2,-2,-2)$ we obtain a greater value. Why don't we get a greater value with a condition $a^2+b^2+c^2\leq8$?
You can't choose $(-2,-2,-2)$ as it does not verify the condition $a^2+b^2+c^2 \leq 8$!!!! I know you are a very smart guy :first: , but not sure what do you mean with your suggestion.

Here is the new problem after we proved that it is not optimal to have a positive coordinate:

Let $a,b,c$ be real numbers such as $-2 \leq a,b,c \leq 0$ and $a^2+b^2+c^2 \leq 8$. Prove that:
$$\sum_{cyc} \frac{1}{16+a^3} \leq \frac{5}{16}$$
This post has been edited 2 times. Last edited by GeoMorocco, Apr 17, 2025, 8:24 AM
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arqady
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#12 • 1 Y
Y by teomihai
GeoMorocco wrote:
arqady wrote:
For $(-2,-2,-2)$ we obtain a greater value. Why don't we get a greater value with a condition $a^2+b^2+c^2\leq8$?
You can't choose $(-2,-2,-2)$ as it does not verify the condition $a^2+b^2+c^2 \leq 8$!!!!
Read please better my previous post.
The function $f$ is convex on $[-2,0]$ and without condition $a^2+b^2+c^2\leq8$ you can get a maximal value by checking $\{a,b,c\}\subset\{-2,0\}$.
Why with this condition you still can take $\{a,b,c\}\subset\{-2,0\}$? If for any $\{a,b,c\}\subset\{-2,0\}$ you'll obtain that the condition indeed occurs, so your reasoning is true. Otherwise, your reasoning is total wrong, I think.
This post has been edited 1 time. Last edited by arqady, Apr 17, 2025, 8:33 AM
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GeoMorocco
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arqady wrote:
Read please better my previous post.
The function $f$ is convex on $[-2,0]$ and without condition $a^2+b^2+c^2\leq8$ you can get a maximal value by checking $\{a,b,c\}\subset\{-2,0\}$.
Why with this condition you still can take $\{a,b,c\}\subset\{-2,0\}$? If for any $\{a,b,c\}\subset\{-2,0\}$ you'll obtain that the condition indeed occurs, so your reasoning is true. Otherwise, your reasoning is total wrong, I think.

I still don't get your point. The condition $a^2+b^2+c^2 \leq 8$ is essential to finding $a,b,c$ not just the border conditions. Check my example:
https://artofproblemsolving.com/community/c6t243f6h3550230_find_the_maxium_of_the_following_expression
This post has been edited 2 times. Last edited by GeoMorocco, Apr 17, 2025, 8:53 AM
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arqady
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GeoMorocco, in your linked problem a maximal value occurs also for $a=-1$ and $-1\notin\{-2,0\}$.
I hope, now you understood me.
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GeoMorocco
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arqady wrote:
GeoMorocco, in your linked problem a maximal value occurs also for $a=-1$ and $-1\notin\{-2,0\}$.
I hope, now you understood me.
Yes, of course. if you check my proof earlier, I said: "convex constraints" and not "convex constraint" which means that I used both constraints to find the maximum.
GeoMorocco wrote:
Therefore, it is enough to study the function for $a,b,c\leq 0$. But the function $f(x)=\frac{1}{16+x^3}$ is convex for $-2\leq x\leq 0$ with convex constraints, so it is enough to check the borders where we get a maximum at $(0,-2,-2)$ equal to $\frac{5}{16}$.
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